I was recently struck by this passage in a 1937 letter from Clark Ashton Smith to Virgil Finlay.
"I think you define very well the main difference between my tales and those of Lovecraft. HPL, in his most characteristic stories, always built up an elaborate and minutely detailed groundwork of realism, no matter how fantastic the eventual departure. Though I have sometimes written tales with an actual setting, I am more at ease when I can weave the entire web on the loom of fantasy. It is probably idle to speculate as to whether one method is more creative than the other. No doubt my own preference is motivated by a certain amount of distaste for the local and the modern, and a sort of nostalgia for impossible and unattainable dreamlands. Yes, I agree with you that my tales - especially the Zothique stories - would call for an arabesque type of illustration, with much ornamental detail; while drawings for HPL's work should be more austere and bleak. Different types, page sizes, bindings, etc., could be utilized appropriately in publishing books by HPL and myself."

It got me to thinking about something I had not really previously considered: did either HPL or CAS get the full treatment in terms of great types, binding, and book design in their own lifetime? It is strange to think that these genius writers, who are so revered in our own time by a broad spectrum of readers and scholars, should have been relegated to the pages of ephemeral pulp mags. I have nothing against pulps, but I am curious as to how CAS or HPL would have felt, never having seen their canonical works enshrined in the pages of a real, solid, and intelligently designed volume.

I also am particularly interested to speculate, as CAS so tantalizingly mentions in the last line of this passage, what the authors themselves would have appreciated in terms of the typefaces and material makeup of a possible book.

Here is a prime example in the modern world of the kind of beauty that can be achieved with a book, and a truly deserved honor done to the text of Lovecraft, as it probably never was in his lifetime. A letterpress edition of Lovecraft's "Shadow Over Innsmouth", with specially designed wood engravings:

[www.heavenlymonkey.com]

I can tell that books were very tactile for Clark. I owned an edition of Moliere plays that I picked up at a bookstore on 14th and Union Sq. in NY for a $1, that was red leather bound, large, with deeply embossed figures on the cover, and Gold design inlays, very rigid spine also embossed, and a gold clasp. He loved it -- I think, however, he was happy with Star Treader's paper cover, and the parchment feel of Sandalwood - - I think he would have been delighted with the book from Harry Potter that needs its spine stroked to allow you to open it - for indeed, since his childhood journeys into the Carnegie in Auburn, opening any new book was to dive bound helplessly into a sacrificial Mayan well, or embark with Sinbad -
like the road in front of Bilbo's - adventure of the mind.
And don't we all love that aspect of discovery?

Just thought I would bump this topic, as I am still pondering the same questions, but have some more work and experience in type and print behind me. It has been a fun year of printing, and really getting to know what happens when the fonts meet the paper. I am delving deeper into imagining the textual beauty of possible HPL and CAS printed works, now through the vehicle of a personal imprint called Viatorium Press. Peruse and enjoy, and let me know what you think, I am keen to get feedback.

www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com

[www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com] Dedicated to the Weird.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30 Jul 10 | 06:27AM by J. F. Uccello.

J. F. Uccello Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am
> curious as to how CAS or HPL would have felt,
> never having seen their canonical works enshrined
> in the pages of a real, solid, and intelligently
> designed volume.

Smith, of course, did get to see this, as Arkham House published handsome collections of his work.

Quote:

as Arkham House published handsome collections of his work.

Indeed. Arkham House has conditioned me to love the sight of Holliston Black Novolex binding, and White Winnebago Eggshell paper filled with linotype Garamond. Now, if only the books had been as "handsomely" edited and proofread....

Yes, being published by Arkham House (at that time) would definitely mean a well made, aesthetically pleasing book. And Arkham's relatively more recent Rendezvous in Averoigne is one of my favorite Weird books ever. Gorgeous in every way, from the J. K. Potter illustrations down to the typography, that book is an example of a book that will last. I also feel a lot of love for the Night Shade editions, which are continuing that tradition of fine books.

There are some great shots of the original CAS Arkhams here: [www.thecimmerian.com]. That Hannes Bok cover of Out of Space and time is wonderful. Those early Arkhams are indeed glorious to behold.

But there is still minimal, if no, letterpress going on for Weird writers. Something about the fonts pressed directly into the paper brings the words to life in a way that can't be done in the offset or digital medium.

[www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com] Dedicated to the Weird.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30 Jul 10 | 06:58PM by J. F. Uccello.

J. F. Uccello Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just thought I would bump this topic, as I am
> still pondering the same questions, but have some
> more work and experience in type and print behind
> me. It has been a fun year of printing, and really
> getting to know what happens when the fonts meet
> the paper. I am delving deeper into imagining the
> textual beauty of possible HPL and CAS printed
> works, now through the vehicle of a personal
> imprint called Viatorium Press. Peruse and enjoy,
> and let me know what you think, I am keen to get
> feedback.
>
> www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com

Feedback: absolutely stunning, evocative and beautifully suitable to CAS' work... are these works for sale? If not then they should be!

Many thanks for the kind words. It was actually quite an intense experience recreating the words of CAS in three dimensional fonts pressed into the paper's surface. It felt like the poems were coming to life, and I seemed to understand them in a deeper way than every before. My respect for CAS's mastery has reached an even higher level than my previous quite high estimation. Printing it took it to the gut level for me. I felt a kind of intense longing and sadness, brought on by some kind of new spark viewed in the depths of the words. Felt like I was communicating, or paying homage to, the dead writer by presenting his words in this way.

I am happy you like it, and very much appreciate your checking it out and commenting.

My email can be found at the Viatorium Press website listed below. Write to me and I will send along a price list of the prints.

[www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com] Dedicated to the Weird.

J. F. Uccello Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I also feel a lot of love
> for the Night Shade editions, which are continuing
> that tradition of fine books.

While I greatly appreciate the effort to collect everything of Smith's, I am not happy with the looks of the Night Shade books. Among other things, there are too many characters to a line for them to be comfortable to read. I think all books should be of at least the standard of the Library of America.

Seconded, regarding Night Shade. The tiny margins in the CAS tales volumes just make the company look cheap, as if it is trying to reduce the number of pages by cramming as much text onto them as possible.

And don't get me started on the jacket "art".... Let's just say that the tradition of embarrassingly bad CAS book covers is alive and well.

Agreed, the Night Shade editions aren't great to look at. Too much text per page and the covers are among the worst I've seen, although I felt vol 4 was an improvement on the earlier vols. At least it wasn't the brown dirge of the first three anyway...

Just checked out your website, J. F. Uccello, and those CAS items are gorgeous indeed. There's nothing quite like hand-set type. I'll email you separately about prices.

Also, lest we forget, the Roy Squires chapbooks were quite fine, too. I bought my first one, Donde duermas Eldorado, as a teenager.

Re: the Night Shade series, I agree, the margins are way too cramped and give the books a cheesy feel. I don't mind the cover art as much as some here. But at least they're not like the absolutely horrible Hodgson editions, with that kitschy embossed jacketless "phony limited edition" look. I don't know what they're thinking over there, but I imagine some decent designer would be happy to assist them in putting out a better-looking product.

garymorris Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But at least they're not like the absolutely
> horrible Hodgson editions, with that kitschy
> embossed jacketless "phony limited edition" look.

They are possibly poisonous, too. Tiny flakes of that silvery stuff they are stamped with come off when you handle them. Wash your hands carefully after reading!

It is perfectly possible, by the way, for small presses to produce books that do not look like "desktop publishing" disasters. The volumes put out by Subterranean Press, for instance, are often remarkably similar to real books. Best of all is Tartarus---with the exception of their Aickman collection, which again has lines of text that are too long and type that is too small.

I just received the first two (of six) volumes of the complete Jack Vance, called the CVIE for Complete Vance Integral Edition. They're huge books but beautifully designed and illustrated. The original VIE, in 44 volumes, was an extraordinary publishing project for which a new typeface was designed.

I contributed an essay on Roger Corman's Poe films to Centipede Press's Poe centenary book, also oversize and very well done indeed. I agree that Tartarus/Ash-Tree books are mostly fine. I like the look and feel of Hippocampus too (and their affordability in most cases).

I feel a bit guilty kvetching about the CAS and Hodgson series when in some ways these are a dream come true and a labor of love. It's just that when you've been invested for literally decades in an author like Smith or Hodgson, you hate to see the "ultimate" editions of their work botched in terms of design. But I'll shut up about this now and remember to be grateful.

I have to agree with the above comments on the typography and design of the Night Shade Press CAS volumes. I want to elaborate, but first we have to look at what our expectations have been set to in the current age of book production. At this time, the NSP CAS volumes are about the best we can expect in a relatively inexpensive edition of Weird fiction. Economically, it would not have been feasible for Night Shade to properly typeset the book with "goldean mean" margins and to have a line length that doesn't tax the eye and make it laborious to move from the end of the column back to the beginning. Just one volume of this series would have been quite large if done properly, which would raise the price considerably. And to try to put out five of these volumes in this day and age, would have been very difficult. But still, the purist in me wants to say that that is no excuse. They could have increased hyphenation, bumped down the point size, narrowed the column width, and perhaps used a more efficient font. In my opinion, even with the reduced point size, the volume would have felt much more spacious and inviting if done this way.

Now, as far as the jackets, there is no excuse. To my eye, there is just no way for me to justify what was done there. These covers just don't work at all. Would have been great to see some J. K. Potter work, what he did for the Arkham House Rendesvouz in Averoinge was remarkable (and that book, by the way, should take precedent as one of the most beautifully designed and wrought books of Weird literature out there). The typography of the titling on the NS cover is indifferent; compare this to the use of the arcane and period-related type used on Rendesvouz, an early twentieth century font called Artistik, which is one of my all time favories. The use of Benguiat Gothic for titling and drop caps by NS seems ok at first, but I am unsatisfied with it. Tor uses this font as well, to much better effect, in their Dune books. Its use could possibly be justified, but it just looks wrong, especially in the drop caps. Perhaps it is just the way its set. Surely someone could have been found to better carry the jacket art.

But compare these problems to some of the Hippocampus books, with cover art so atrocious (Shadow of the Unattained) I don't know how it could have escaped from the publisher. And a lot of Hippocampus is print on demand, which is not built to last, and the digitally printed type looks like it's going to fall off the page (probably will in a few years). And the Lovecraft Penguin editions, though they are generally pleasing (especially cover art), use a fine font (Sabon?), and have a decent line length, suffer from inconsistent typography (look at page 321 of Dreams in the Witch House for an example).

Night Shade appears to be the only one using high quality, pleasing paper stock, cloth bound boards, and signature sewn bindings. So despite the flaws, they are made to last, and have the feel of a real book. They are also printed with offset lithography, which sets the typeface into the paper, giving a smooth and attractive reading surface.

Overall Night Shade is the best out there for new editions of the Weird, and especially of CAS. At least they are making a real attempt to make a classic book of lasting value.

And I want to say that I don't necessarily think I could do better in terms of design. I wasn't the designer, so I don't know what specific problems had to be overcome. To critique such a great edition, textually speaking (and in this regard it is to be highly commended), on its design flaws might be considered churlish, but design is certainly important, if not crucial in some cases.

[www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com] Dedicated to the Weird.



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 1 Aug 10 | 08:45PM by J. F. Uccello.

garymorris Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just checked out your website, J. F. Uccello, and
> those CAS items are gorgeous indeed. There's
> nothing quite like hand-set type.
>
> Also, lest we forget, the Roy Squires chapbooks
> were quite fine, too. I bought my first one, Donde
> duermas Eldorado, as a teenager.

Thanks for the kind words, I hope to hear from you.

I was about to start a thread about Mr Squires and RAS Press. I am just now finding out about him, and would very much like to hear more about his work. I downloaded the prospectus of The Black Abbot of Puthuum, and am intrigued about this posthumous revival piece. I'd like to get a hold of a copy, cerainly, though I imagine it's going for quite a bit these days.

[www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com] Dedicated to the Weird.

J. F. Uccello,

Thanks for the fine in-depth analysis. I would quibble about a few points (the Night Shade CAS volumes are not especially inexpensive, as they list for nearly forty dollars apiece, and I think that the J.K Potter's work is dreadful, as well), but in the main your points are good ones.

I am glad to see someone call out Hippocampus, in particular, regarding their occasionally shabby-looking books. Anything that is print on demand ought to be clearly labeled as such. Night Shade's books, by contrast, do appear to use good-quality paper and binding, as you say. On the other hand, the proofreading for the CAS volumes, particularly numbers three and four, was atrocious.

I would add that reasonable, fact-based criticism is hardly an instance of ingratitude or rudeness--especially when it comes from paying customers. Publishers need to listen to their readers, and it does no one any favors to turn a blind eye toward needlessly shoddy product.

Hippocampus should be upbraided on their belligerent use of drop shadows alone. But the art that they (I can't imagine they commission it) somehow get for most of their covers just boggles the mind. And although I commend the fact that they used a CAS drawing for The Last Oblivion, that drawing really doesn't do justice (sorry Clark) to the poetry within. Nor does the limp type treatments of the poems themselves. A fake oblique bold face to title the poems, where small caps or real italics would have done more elegantly, and an inexplicable bolding of the first letter of each poem. Why? And why did they choose this particular typeface when there are others that would have been so much stronger (Adobe Jenson, Bruce Rogers' Centaur?).

I agree wholeheartedly with you Absquatch (though I still have a fondness for the cheesy Potter art in Rendesvouz). Just because the Weird literature we love has been ghettoized for decades, does not mean we should be happy about declining standards of typography, illustration, and design. If anything, Weird books coming out these days should be trying to improve on the standard set by Arkham House. I just got one of the old Arkhams from the seventies, a pre-Joshi era Dagon and Others. Here is what the colophon says: "A fourth printing of four thousand copies of this book has been made in November 1975 by Edwards Brothers, Inc., Ann Arbor, Michigan, from Linotype Garamond, printed Offset on 50# Booknatural. The binding cloth is Holliston Black Novelex." This is what is so endearing about an old Arkham House book. Quality and lineage. And that primitive Utpatel drawing on the cover. This book may not be perfect design-wise, but I know that I like it because I keep picking it up and reading it. It is pleasing, has life and character to it.

What will the next generation of readers, say 50 years down the line, say when they pick up a print on demand book that was carelessly churned out in our era? How is this age to be looked upon. I would be dramatic and say a Dark Age of the book. Even mass market paperbacks from the 70's have beautiful cover art, smell nice, and have a pulpy charm (I'm looking at my Fungi From Yuggoth and Others from Ballantine). I don't think we can say the same for much of what is passed off as publishing these days.

But lest I seem completely ungrateful I do want to say that I am glad that at least Weird material is being kept in print by a dedicated few. I would rather have my copy of The Last Oblivion than nothing at all. I don't have a few thousand dollars to get a first edition of Ebony and Crystal. In this tyring time of financial difficulty and the book itself under attack from all sides, I am grateful to the Weird publishers for battling all the problems of working in this field. They are to be commended, but I just wish the simple expedient of good design sense could me more widely employed.

And I guess if we want it done right, we just have to do it ourselves.

[www.viatoriumpress.blogspot.com] Dedicated to the Weird.

Page-numbering belongs only in academic literature. It has no place in fiction. I know it has been used from the early beginning, even when discrete well balanced typeface aesthetic and careful paragraphing design was used (aimed at leading the reader's attention into the world of the author as much as possible, and not to draw attention in itself) in books at the turn and beginning of the last century (all the way up to the 1980s I would say, when vulgar commercialism on a big scale started to outmaneuver artistic integrity, both in books and film). But I still think page-numbering is a mistake.

I bound my own copy of Merritt's The Fox Woman & Other Stories, because I couldn't find nice published copy (and also because the published version does not include the short-story The Moon Pool, which I added last in the back of my own copy). I purposely excluded page-numbers throughout the book, and I can say that it makes for much more pleasant reading! "Adventurous expectancy!", as Lovecraft would put it. Not fore-planned traveling, in the company of others, with every step retricted by a punctilious travel-guide, stifling the freedom of discovery.

When going to the cinema, you don't see a clock counting the seconds, minutes, and hours at the bottom of the picture, do you? And wouldn't want to. You want the film to develop through its own rythm, unknown length, unexpected turns, and ending, free of your mental restrictions expectations.
And when reading a tale aloud by the hearthside, each time you leaf over you don't say, "...page 21...," "...page 22...," "...page 23...,"..... That's a good way of destroying the spell. And ruining poetry.

No, page-numbering only belongs in academic literature.

Some impressive paper-works in this thread! Most impressive!