Hello,

tried contacting several E-Mails regarding this, no answers so far. I'm interested in doing a small run of the Seven Geases (with handmade original engravings), but I don't want it to be an Bootleg. Can someone direct me towards the right person regarding this?

All the best!

okkultokkult Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hello,
>
> tried contacting several E-Mails regarding this,
> no answers so far. I'm interested in doing a small
> run of the Seven Geases (with handmade original
> engravings), but I don't want it to be an Bootleg.
> Can someone direct me towards the right person
> regarding this?
>
> All the best!

My understanding of the copyright situation, for what it is worth.

"The Seven Geases" was published in Weird Tales in October 1934. Clark Ashton Smith retained the rights to the story. According to the copyright scheme in effect at the time, copyright lasted 28 years from publication, unless it was renewed by the copyright holder in the 28th year, in which case it lasted an additional 28 years.

The story next appeared in an Arkham House volume LOST WORLDS in 1944. This did not renew the copyright to the story, as that could only be done in the 28th year.

In 1961, CAS died, and all his literary rights passed to his wife, I believe by Will, and eventually, when she died, to one or more of her children (CAS's stepchildren).

Circa 1962, the story entered public domain, there having been no valid renewal, and the story first having been published 28 years earlier. That year, the owner of Weird Tales did renew its copyright to the 1934 issues of WEIRD TALES, but this could not cover "The Seven Geases", since they did not own it. Only the owner (the heir of CAS) could renew the copyright, and he/she failed to do so.

Circa 1972, Arkham House renewed its copyright to LOST WORLDS, but this could not cover "The Seven Geases", as it had already entered public domain.

Later, Congress extended copyright, so that material still under copyright would last more than 56 years after publication, and this would have affected "The Seven Geases" had the copyright been renewed. But it could only affect material that was still under copyright at the time of the extension.

Since it is public domain, it cannot be "bootleg". To be on the safe side, you might want to use the WEIRD TALES text, though I am not aware of any significant differences.

Last I heard, there was indeed a representative of the estate of CAS (representing the descendants of CAS's wife perhaps in alliance with Arkham House), which at one time was happy to negotiate with people for permissions related to CAS works, including those they did not necessarily own. To be doubly safe, you could get permission from them. But I do not have any contact information for them. And again, as I understand it, they are not the "right person" as they do not own the text.

Please do not construe this as legal advice. Get your own legal advice, or take your own risks.



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 14 Nov 22 | 01:26PM by Platypus.

At one time, there was the following contact information:

William A. Dorman
Executor, CASiana Enterprises
The Literary Estate of Clark Ashton Smith
4543 North Avenue
Sacramento CA 95821
Phone: 1 - 916 - 585 0591 [Office]
E-mail: dormanw@csus.edu
---------------------------------------------x
Professor William A. Dorman was, IIRC, the stepson of CAS.

However, it appears that he died this year, of cancer, on April 26, 2022. He was 81 years old
[www.legacy.com]

This could explains why emails are going unanswered. At least in theory, though, CASiana Enterprises should still exist as a legal entity.



Edited 6 time(s). Last edit at 14 Nov 22 | 01:53PM by Platypus.

This is unrelated to the matter of copyright, but I'm sincerely saddened by this news of Dr. Dorman's death. I briefly corresponded with him only four months before his passing, asking for his permission to bind a book of my favorite CAS stories for personal use. He wholeheartedly allowed it, and also sent me files containing Nightshade's versions of the original tales. From what little I knew, he seemed to be a kind, confident, and intelligent gentleman.

I was just planning to send him an email regarding CAS' haiku, but it seems this is impossible now. Whatever knowledge he had will pass with him into the "sea of Being", as CAS called it. Even if we were never friends, I wish him a good journey.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 15 Nov 22 | 04:32AM by Hespire.

Hespire Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is unrelated to the matter of copyright, but
> I'm sincerely saddened by this news of Dr.
> Dorman's death. I briefly corresponded with him
> only four months before his passing, asking for
> his permission to bind a book of my favorite CAS
> stories for personal use. He wholeheartedly
> allowed it, and also sent me files containing
> Nightshade's versions of the original tales. From
> what little I knew, he seemed to be a kind,
> confident, and intelligent gentleman.
>
> I was just planning to send him an email regarding
> CAS' haiku, but it seems this is impossible now.
> Whatever knowledge he had will pass with him into
> the "sea of Being", as CAS called it. Even if we
> were never friends, I wish him a good journey.

I've never had contact with him.

Casiana Literary Enterprises was formed in 1979, over 43 years ago, and he has been Casiana for all that time, as far as I know. His two sisters survive him, apparently, but it is unclear if anyone will have any interest in taking up the mantle.

Hespire, may I ask what stories were on your list of your favorites? Did you complete the project?

Platypus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hespire, may I ask what stories were on your list
> of your favorites? Did you complete the project?


I certainly did, complete with an illustration by my wife. It was made for both of us, but our favorite stories happen to be the same.

Sadastor
A Night in Malnéant
The Tale of Satampra Zeiros
The Monster of the Prophecy
A Voyage to Sfanomoë
The Demon of the Flower
A Vintage from Atlantis
The Empire of the Necromancers
Ubbo-Sathla
The Double Shadow
The Ice-Demon
The Isle of the Torturers
The Dweller in the Gulf
The Maze of the Enchanter
The Third Episode of Vathek
Genius Loci
The Secret of the Cairn
The Voyage of King Euvoran
Vulthoom
The Death of Malygris
The Coming of the White Worm
The Witchcraft of Ulua
Xeethra
Necromancy in Naat
Mother of Toads
Symposium of the Gorgon

We had to leave out "The Chain of Aforgomon" for space. And "The Eternal World" was dropped due to my wife's lack of enthusiasm for it. I acknowledge its weakness as a narrative, but admire its sheer cosmic imagination!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 18 Nov 22 | 01:30PM by Hespire.

I'd like to add that I was one of several people who requested Dr. Dorman's permission in binding books of Smith's stories. He said an Irish woman asked the same thing I did only a week before I contacted him.

Hespire, I like your choices. Maybe not all of them, but probably more than I have a right to expect given the inevitable differences in taste.

One that you left out, that I rather like, is "The Abominations of Yondo". I'm not saying it's particularly good or ought to be on your list. I am just rather fond of it. I mention this because I happened to find the original published text, in the Overland Monthly, online via a google books search:

[books.google.com]

This is no criticism, Hespire, but I would be interested in hearing you and your wife's feelings about The Dark Eidolon.

Did you see some weaknesses, or was it simply that it did not appeal to your personal preferences as much as the others?

The phantasmagoria at the banquet is one of my favorite passages in CAS, like the thrice repeated incantation in The Double Shadow.

--Sawfish

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"The food at the new restaurant is awful, but at least the portions are large."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19 Nov 22 | 02:01PM by Sawfish.

To Platypus and Sawfish (a menagerie fitting of this bizarre place, no?), some stories were unfortunately left out due to space. We couldn't make the perfect book of favorites, but it's dang near perfect in our eyes.

I considered "Abominations", which is one of my personal favorites too, but I decided "Sadastor" made a better introduction, as a brief but perfect representation of CAS as a morbidly romantic poet. I've read the Overland Monthly publication as well; it's a hoot imagining how U. S. citizens would have reacted to such demonic psychedelia! I imagine CAS would have found more success with it if he had been living in France.

My wife and I spent some time considering "Dark Eidolon", Sawfish. It's almost tied with "Aforgomon" as the best story left out. I can't speak for my wife, but I think it had no noticeable weaknesses. In some segments it reminded me of my favorite poem "The Hashish-Eater", feeling just as drunken and delirious with sorcerous demiurgy. But unlike the poem, the story links its bewildering visions with a central theme and narrative, which helps intensify the experience like a growing nightmare. I suppose the only issue was our inclusion of the "Third Episode", the longest story in the book. If it weren't for that, "Eidolon" would have been a definite shoe-in, but we consider "Third Episode" one of the great literary fantasies and had to include it, even though Smith had only written half of it.

Out of curiosity, if you two (or anyone else) had a chance to bind your very own book of Smith, what would your selection of favorites be?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 20 Nov 22 | 03:03AM by Hespire.

My personal list from what I have read by Smith so far (about fifty stories) would be:

Genius Loci
Murder In The Fourth Dimension
Beast of Averoigne
The Double Cosmos
The Supernumerary Corpse
The Uncharted Islad
The Treader Of The Dust
The Empire Of Necromancers
The Second Interment
The Maker Of The Gargoyles
The Gorgon
The End Of The Story
Monsters In The Night
The Abominations Of Yondo
The Vaults Of Yoh-Vombis
The Seed From The Sepulcher

A good list of horror stories, Cthulhu. That looks largely publishable!

Dear Platypus,

I wanna thank you very much for your detailed answer! You helped a lot. It's really nice to see that places like this still exist on the internet.

Sad to hear about the passing of Mr. Dorman. My condolences to the people who knew him.

Just out of curiosity ... Is there a way for a normal individual to find out what are the prices of publication rights of a literary work? For example (it is really just an example) I have decided to publish an anthology of short stories by Oliver Onions. Is there a way to find out what is the price of the publication rights of his stories?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 17 Dec 22 | 12:57PM by Minicthulhu.