I am still learning about CAS and may I say reading his work is like escaping from the confines of this world and going on a real vacation. But he was human and I am curious to know whether or not he ever had time periods where he knew what he wanted to say but could not find the language to present it properly. How did he deal with the anger which comes from it and how did he eventually overcome it. I am finishing a weird sketch and would like to know how CAS dealt with this sort of thing.

From conversations with Clark over several years, I can tell you only my impressions, as we discussed literature in general, and the act of writing in particular - When I knew him, the majority of his corpus had been completed, though a few more pieces emerged in the last years. Facility in acquiring a "style" comes from writing lots -
Clark did not express to me having had anger about writer's "block" - his general approach to all things if he encountered an obstacle was to just do something else for a while and then return to the previous project - whether writing, carving, or removing a large rock from where the garden might be expanding - he believed the mind would continue to work on the problem whether he was consciously concentrating on it or not, and when he returned to it, lo, it was solved or no longer mattered as something more interesting had shown up. In this way, a lot of carving got done and fired, wood was cut for the stove, fruit picked for the neighbours, or whatever - his writing however, shows few signs of interruption - that he experienced the frustration of "having" to write for publication, rather than investing the entire energy of his life into poetry, caused some very rough times for him emotionally in the beginning. You and I cannot imagine the penury under which he lived, and indeed, thrived -
he had simplicity of life without choice -- re-enforced by absolute loyalty to elderly parents - and then a world that changed too fast -
As a side note for helping with writer's block - Clark did a great deal of "free association" in conversaton - some writer's suggest just jotting down whatever comes into the mind as a way of getting through it; Clark would not have considered it a conscious technique, but just did it - his vast reading made it possible to range from one moment discussing the "Roman de la Rose" to relating that to Hegel's "Phenomenology of Mind".

It's interesting that CAS, who appeared to disdain the Surrealists, practiced such techniques as unconscious incubation and free association, which were so dear to the latter.

I would add with regard to writer's block and the like, that the more you desperately strive after something, the less likely you are to obtain it. Quit wanting it so much. Also, don't miss CAS's own writing tips.

While you are at it, ask yourself the question, "Why do I want to write?" Do you have something that you truly want to express, and (this is the important part) would you express it even if there was a certainty that no one else would read it? Or do you just want to be "A Writer", one who is known and acclaimed by others? If the former, then I wish you every success. If the latter, then I wish you miserable failure, because we already have far too many such types.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 9 Oct 09 | 08:23AM by Kyberean.

Kyberean Wrote:
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> While you are at it, ask yourself the question,
> "Why do I want to write?" Do you have something
> that you truly want to express, and (this is the
> important part) would you express it even if there
> was a certainty that no one else would read it? Or
> do you just want to be "A Writer", one who is
> known and acclaimed by others? If the former, then
> I wish you every success. If the latter, then I
> wish you miserable failure, because we already
> have far too many such types.


I do not think writing, or art in general for that matter, has anything to do with "expressing yourself." Hence the desire to become A Writer seems to me just as fine a source of motivation as anything else. Remember, Smith wrote stories in order to put food on the table, and he certainly would not have if he had thought nobody would read them.

One becomes a writer, much as one becomes anything, however, by actually doing it, not by sitting around having fantasies about doing it. To experience "writer's block" one first needs to be a writer---i.e., one needs to have written something that was published---otherwise most of the world's population could be said to be suffering from the affliction, rendering the concept meaningless.

Quote:

I do not think writing, or art in general for that matter, has anything to do with "expressing yourself."

Read more carefully, please. I did not write "expressing yourself". I wrote "something to express". I hope that I don't have to explain the rather obvious difference.

Quote:

Remember, Smith wrote stories in order to put food on the table, and he certainly would not have if he had thought nobody would read them.

Maybe, maybe not. You have no way of knowing. CAS certainly did not write "The Abominations of Yondo" with great remuneration in mind. In fact, he did not even have a publisher for it at the time that he conceived and wrote that story.

Like many, you also seem to be forgetting that CAS was a poet. Did he write "The Star-Treader" to put food onto the table, as well, or did he do so in order to magnify his ego by attaining the acclaim of a wide readership? I rather doubt it.

Anyway, enough responding to trollishness. CD, if you read this, my point is merely that writing should be intrinsically motivated and should arise from inner desire, even necessity. Yet, paradoxically, it is also not something that should become an object of intense desire and craving unto itself. If you find that to be worthwhile advice, then you are welcome to it. If not, then best of luck, anyway.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 9 Oct 09 | 11:20AM by Kyberean.

Kyberean Wrote:
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> You also
> seem to be forgetting that CAS was a poet. Did he
> write "The Star-Treader" to put food onto the
> table, as well?

Notice how careful I was to say stories specifically. Who knows why people write poetry, really?

Yes, I did notice, but we are talking about writing, in general, and poetry is germane, here.

Who knows why people do anything, including engage in pointless online debate and repartee? ;-)

Jojo Lapin X Wrote:
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> Notice how careful I was to say stories
> specifically. Who knows why people write poetry,
> really?

Kyberean Wrote:
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> Who knows why people do anything, including engage
> in pointless online debate...

Oh, it's the ol' cat-and-dog fight.




Kyberean Wrote:
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> the more you desperately strive after
> something, the less likely you are to obtain it.
> Quit wanting it so much.

What exactly do you mean by that?? This "wanting" is something I myself have been struggling with in my creative endeavours, and it seems to automatically repel others, and I just don't understand it. What I really desire, others choose not to oblige, out of sheer spitefulness it seems. (I guess it's a whiff of the old Oedipus.) (And I have this paralyzing fear that no one will ever want to pay for anything I do, no matter how good, simply because I don't like people,... a dislike which fills me with guilt, and hinders me from deserving anything. Want to be loved... but don't trust. And for good reason, because in weaknesses, humans are an ugly lot when scratching on the surface. So I choose to hide from the World instead of going out and taking chances. Sorry for undressing my personal issues like this on the forum, but it's a problem that just keeps clinging and can't be rid of, no matter how rational and wisely I try to reason it... so I have nothing to loose by telling it.) What difference does it make if one eagerly wants something? Why should it repel people? The desire, and ones ability or talent (or lack of), are two different things, being parallell. Naturally anyone who's is into some form of artistic expression, also wants to have success.

If I compare myself to CAS, I believe his misantrophy was more of an intellectual, pilosophical standpoint. Rather than emotional dysfunction. Anyway, his artistic success comes from natural talent, and a willingness to be openminded and learn, and be led by what he observes, rather than trying to force forth something by sheer will-power and aggression.

Quote:

Oh, it's the ol' cat-and-dog fight.

Well, not in this case. Though I don't always succeed, I try not to take Internet teapot tempests too seriously. Sometimes these exchanges generate at least as much light as heat, but more often it's the opposite, sad to say.

Quote:

Kyberean Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> the more you desperately strive after
> something, the less likely you are to obtain it.
> Quit wanting it so much.

What exactly do you mean by that??

I am referring here to being blocked from creating, and not to others' reception of one's work. What I mean by not wanting something so much is that one tends to be overcome by desire, usually with a strong basis in personal ego, and thereby loses sight of the means to achieve the aim. My experience is that the more desperately one desires something, the more one focuses on the end, rather than calmly pursuing the means of achieving it.

Quote:

Naturally anyone who's is into some form of artistic expression, also wants to have success.

If, by "success", you mean sales, acclaim, and recognition by others, then I do not agree, but I realize that my position here is that of an extreme minority. For instance, I write a certain amount of poetry. I would like to see more of it published, one day, but I really do not care whether it is or it isn't. I would write it even if I were certain that no one else would read it, simply for the pleasure of doing so.

On the other hand, I have released a few CDs' worth of my electroacoustic music, and it has achieved a certain acclaim, in its tiny way, but, again, its external reception has nothing to do with whether I create music, or not.

As an aside, I would add that, although there was a strong emotional component underlying CAS's misanthropy, I agree with you that it is incorrect to dismiss his misanthropy as mere pathology. As misanthropy matures, however, my view is that it should ripen into indifference toward humans and the human aquarium, en masse. That perspective seems more healthy to me, at any rate.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10 Oct 09 | 11:44AM by Kyberean.

Many thanks. There's some food here for me to meditate on.

I was trying to make a joke with the cat-and-dog thing. It was merely lightly serious.

As pointed out here I feel writers block stems from our human fear of wanting to succeed. This fear can stem from many different psychological obstacles. But ultimately I think it stems from wanting to succeed. Wanting to succeed is not a bad thing. In either getting printed or succeeding in capturing your creations perfectly on paper. Either way that is succeeding. Me, I think its a little bit of both. Each time I write I 'bleed' all over myself because A. I try so hard to express my work as clearly as possible. Maybe even more clearly than is humanly possible. And B. So that other people can see and feel my work to the degree that I feel and see it. I think this is extant in each and everyone of us to some degree, whether we care to admit it or not. For those who say they write just to write and do not give a 'dam' what becomes of it, some are truthful, and to those people I must say I admire you. But the majority of us are not that way.

Clark Ashton Smith is extremely talented and I feel he wanted to put fourth his best stuff and have it printed. I am still learning a lot about this fascinating individual so I may be wrong here.

H.P. Lovecraft wanted to express his work as clearly as he envisioned it. Most of the time he said he failed. He exercised this outward persona of being an old gentlemen who only created just to create, but he did care what ultimately would happen to his stuff.

Me, again I hope to get many books published and have some degree of success. I hope to die knowing people have read and enjoyed my work. That they felt something, learned something and had many boring days relieved thanks to my stuff. I am even beginning this silly ritual now of creating my diary and saving MS's of my work and records of me doing things in hopes that these will be around when I die so that if others stumble across them they will know I lived and was a writer. Silly yes, psychotic, maybe.

But all of us want to succeed either creatively, personally or both. However talent must exist.

But publishing companies or people who say you do not have talent are idiots just because you do not write like the majority and follow the heard. This may be trite but look at Edgar A. Poe. In his time he was not very big, except maybe for his creation of The Raven. Mr. Graham didn't worship Poe or say he was good but look where Poe now. His work hasn't changed. Our outlook has changed and that is why Poe is where he is. For him we have put away our shallow, materialistic views and took an honest look at human art. At least for the human character Edgar A. Poe. We have done the same for others as can well be guessed.

So I think all of us want both success and recognition and whether we are good or not is relative. Everything depends on the outlook of other people. One last example- Emily Dickinson.

Knygatin:

I am glad that my remarks offered food for thought.

Also, I realized you were joking with the "cat and dog" reference, and I appreciated the multiple layers of meaning, as well. I just thought it was as good a time as any to expand upon my own views of the matter in a slightly more serious vein.

CD:

I think that you have a mature, balanced, and thoughtful perspective on the issue. Everyone needs to find his own balance here, certainly. I simply suspect that concerning oneself too much with the desire to be a writer, per se, can paradoxically interfere with with one's ability to achieve that aim. I would add that your reference to Dickinson is very apropos, to me, at any rate.

Anyway, best of luck in finding the balance you seek.

Kyberean Wrote:
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> Knygatin:
>
> I am glad that my remarks offered food for
> thought.

Yeah, and especially in the important value of hearing it coming from someone else. It gives it an added dimension and weight. I think along similar lines, and am aware of how lack of concentration and haste ruins art. But it is not every day one is told by another, to confirm what one otherwise has to carry all alone.

Kyberean: You are correct. If a person keeps his perspective on merely becoming a "writer" then he or she forgets to have fun with merely being a creator. Writing, just like with anything in life, is about the fun of creating. I to wish you luck with whatever the purpose of your journey in life is. Thank you very much for your intuitive and settled advice.

Clark Smith did not like surrealists ?