Lovecraft and CAS are obviously well documented. However, what about the lesser known individuals of their lives. F. Lee Baldwin, R.H. Barlow, James F. Morton, Rheinhart Kleiner, Kenneth Sterling. I'm sure this and many other people may be covered in books but where can one find out information on what became of them; especially their death dates and where they are buried. Especially R.H. Barlow and the entire Barlow family- ashes scattered??? I know this may be a morbid question but all of us have a bit of morbid curiosity within them.

Thanks all and happy late Easter.

The internet will often provide guidelines to questions, if you Google. If it's not there, then it likely doesn't exist. Wikipedia has some information on Barlow.

Why are you interested in these persons, and specifically Barlow? What is so fascinating about him?

Knygatin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The internet will often provide guidelines to
> questions, if you Google. If it's not there, then
> it likely doesn't exist. Wikipedia has some
> information on Barlow.
>
> Why are you interested in these persons, and
> specifically Barlow? What is so fascinating about
> him?

It is weird but I enjoy Barlow's work, the little that hes done and I seem to relate to him. His life, his struggles (except the gay part) and his views I can relate to. I don't know its tough to explain. I'm also that way with Lovecraft.

I enjoyed the images in Collapsing Cosmoses, and remember The Night Ocean as a well-written dreamy sojourn by an East coast sandy shore.

Personally though, I am very careful in selecting model ideals for inspiration. I prefer individuals of stronger constitution. I think that is important, as I myself am rather emotional and mentally fragile, and experience that outside guidelines can have significant impression over time.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 16 Apr 09 | 03:37AM by Knygatin.

Knygatin Wrote:
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> Personally though, I am very careful in selecting
> model ideals for inspiration.

At the same time I can appreciate to some degree a fascination for exploring the lives of ordinary, mediocre, or unsuccessful individuals. It feeds a pioneer need to visit or hold on to something (whatever it my be) that is rare simply by being unknown to the masses. And also serves as a realistic study of the general destinies of ordinary people, which is useful to an artist.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 16 Apr 09 | 05:49AM by Knygatin.

Knygatin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Knygatin Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Personally though, I am very careful in
> selecting
> > model ideals for inspiration.
>
> At the same time I can appreciate to some degree a
> fascination for exploring the lives of ordinary,
> mediocre, or unsuccessful individuals. It feeds a
> pioneer need to visit or hold on to something
> (whatever it my be) that is rare simply by being
> unknown to the masses. And also serves as a
> realistic study of the general destinies of
> ordinary people, which is useful to an artist

On the other end of the spectrum I can say I admire the work of Ambrose Bierce. His sense of individualism was strong and he had that attitude of "I write what I want and don't cross me" and that really strengthens each one of my individual artistic steps. He even said that the short story is superior to the novel because in actuality the novel is a much padded short story.

OConnor,CD Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lovecraft and CAS are obviously well documented.
> However, what about the lesser known individuals
> of their lives. F. Lee Baldwin, R.H. Barlow, James
> F. Morton, Rheinhart Kleiner, Kenneth Sterling.
> I'm sure this and many other people may be covered
> in books but where can one find out information on
> what became of them; especially their death dates
> and where they are buried. Especially R.H. Barlow
> and the entire Barlow family- ashes scattered??? I
> know this may be a morbid question but all of us
> have a bit of morbid curiosity within them.
>
> Thanks all and happy late Easter.

The H. P. Lovecraft Encyclopedia [www.hippocampuspress.com] has entries on many of HPL's (and thus also CAS's) associates (although not burial information!). Most of this information isn't in the internet (e.g. Wikipedia) unless it has been nicked from works like this! I think many of these persons were interesting figures in their own right, but unless they were also authors of note not much is generally known of them. The introductions to HPL's published letter collections by Joshi & Schultz include some biographical details, such as the letters to Kleiner and Barlow (the latter also has autobiographical material appended). And if I'm not mistaken, Massimo Berruti who used to be a member of EOD has been working on a monograph on Barlow which might come out some time in the future. James F. Morton is one I personally would like to know more about as he seems to have been a remarkable individual; I thought that Hippocampus Press was going to publish Lovecraft's letters to him (or what exists in transcripts by Arkham House, & presumably what also survives of Morton's side) but it seems that this has been delayed, maybe because other collections (HPL/REH, HPL/CAS) have been given higher priority. The letters to Morton are well presented in AH's Selected Letters, but aside from casting light on JFM, such a volume would be very welcome as Lovecraft's epistles to him are probably among his most interesting letter cycles.

If for some reason you just want the death dates, some (but only some...) are listed here: [www.hplovecraft.com]
Not sure if that's entirely up to date, but even if it isn't, very few people who knew HPL are actually still alive (such as Harry Brobst, the last I heard anyway).

- JMR

walrus Wrote:
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very few people who knew HPL are
> actually still alive (such as Harry Brobst, the
> last I heard anyway).
>
> - JMR


There are actually people still alive today who knew Lovecraft in person? That is a fascinating, long lasting, link. It would be interesting to hear these people speak personally about Lovecraft today (like Dr Farmer shares personal memories of CAS here on this site). A video interview would be great, to hear and sense the energies that have been in direct connection to Lovecraft.

Yes, Harry Brobst celebrated his 100th birthday in February -- he lived in Providence in the 1930s, visited HPL in the hospital during his final days, and attended his funeral. AFAIK, he has already shared his memories of HPL in a telephone interview with Will Murray, played at the Lovecraft Centennial Conference in 1991 and printed (in part) in Lovecraft Remembered.

There is also, according to Ken Faig, Jr., a member of the Phillips family who visited HPL and Annie Gamwell at 66 College Street when she was five years old.

It feels almost like having some stately Roman, or noble well-dressed gentleman of the 1700s, come alive and walk among us today in this our shabby time in history, the ghost or spirit of Lovecraft still hibernating in secluded corners. I wish these last glimmering remains were contacted and let shine some light.

That telephone interview with Harry Brobst played at the Conference, was a nice initiative.

> Knygatin Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------

> I can appreciate to some degree a
> fascination for exploring the lives of ordinary,
> mediocre, or unsuccessful individuals. It feeds a
> pioneer need to visit or hold on to something
> (whatever it my be) that is rare simply by being
> unknown to the masses. And also serves as a
> realistic study of the general destinies of
> ordinary people, which is useful to an artist


This last discussion gives one more reason for being interested.

With open eyes, one can probably discover exciting aspects in every person's life.



OConnor,CD Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He even said that the short story
> is superior to the novel because in actuality the
> novel is a much padded short story.~

Yes, I often think a story should not be longer than it can be read in one comfortable sitting. I rather experience a work of art in whole, and not split up in parts. (But of course, coming back night after night, to a good evolving story, has its charm too.)

And all that padded filler in most novels is very annoying. Every sentence should be essential.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 19 Apr 09 | 02:57AM by Knygatin.

Knygatin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It feels almost like having some stately Roman, or
> noble well-dressed gentleman of the 1700s, come
> alive and walk among us today in this our shabby
> time in history, the ghost or spirit of Lovecraft
> still hibernating in secluded corners. I wish
> these last glimmering remains were contacted and
> let shine some light.
>
> That telephone interview with Harry Brobst played
> at the Conference, was a nice initiative.

HPL would have understood the sentiment -- he was himself fascinated to have met, as a child, a person who had been born in his beloved 18th century.

Of course practically anyone who is known to have known Lovecraft and is still alive has been contacted at some point and many have written memoirs -- if you don't have it, you should get Lovecraft Remembered, it's perhaps an even more valuable work than STJ's biography. The Brobst interview is very worthwhile -- and the W. Paul Cook memoir is probably alone worth the price of admission. I don't offhand remember who aside from Brobst is still with us since several others have passed recently (such as Forrest J Ackerman), but there are some -- although not necessarily anyone who had met him in person.

About Barlow -- he's a tragic figure who had great promise. Who knows what might have been if Donald Wandrei hadn't bullied him out of the picture?

- JMR

walrus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> -- if you don't have it, you should get
> Lovecraft Remembered, it's perhaps an even more
> valuable work than STJ's biography. The Brobst
> interview is very worthwhile -- and the W. Paul
> Cook memoir is probably alone worth the price of
> admission.
>
> - JMR

Are you sure, are they really evocative and presenting part of Lovecraft's spirit? Aside from those who actually met him in life, I would think a written biography as rather constructed. Reading Lovecraft's own letters, has let me come close to him, and more letters a being published all the time. I did read Long's Dreamer on the Nightside many years ago, but don't remember that it was very enjoyable. Few are as descriptively talented as Lovecraft. Seeing, or hearing them talk live, is another matter, since that has all its own mediating of complex energies.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 19 Apr 09 | 02:53PM by Knygatin.

I agree with walrus: Lovecraft Remembered is a great book, and W. Paul Cook's memoir in particular makes it worth buying. I also remember nice memoirs by Donald Wandrei, Rheinhart Kleiner, E. A. Edkins, and Dorothy C. Walter. They definitely make HPL come alive.

Dreamer on the Night Side was written 50 years after the events it describes, so it's not that reliable. Besides, it was apparently so muddled that it had to be quietly revised by the editor of Arkham House, James Turner.

Knygatin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Are you sure, are they really evocative and presenting part of Lovecraft's spirit? Aside from those who actually met him in life, I would think a written biography as rather constructed.

Most of the items collected in that book are by people who knew or had met him in person, and are thus invaluable. Many are not very long, but a collective picture emerges from them nonetheless. If one just reads the letters -- vast though the amount is -- the image will still be incomplete (as it of course is even with the memoirs, but less so).

> Reading Lovecraft's own letters, has let me come close to him, and more letters a being published all the time.

Naturally the letters are a priority -- but I would still highly recommend LR as an accompaniment.

> I did read Long's Dreamer on the Nightside many years ago, but don't remember that it was very enjoyable. Few are as descriptively talented as Lovecraft. Seeing, or hearing them talk live,
> is another matter, since that has all its own mediating of complex energies.

As Martin indicated, Long's book is problematic and generally not held in high regard, and I suppose it could be described as very much a wasted opportunity -- but the circumstances of its writing are that Long was alarmed of DeCamp's upcoming bio and put his memoir together in very quick order. Alas, since he perhaps knew HPL better than anyone else.

- JMR